What have I said? All I’m saying is that some, not allof the people currently in the middle class will be in the poor house if they lose their jobs due to the current economy. Nothing worldy about that. It’s just a fact. Would stating that “putting your hand on a hot stove could result in a burned hand” be worldly, un-Christian wisdom?

Let’s dispense with the ‘think what could happen’ talking rooted in fear.

Who, other than our government, is doing that?

We also have stores of financial wealth in stocks, bonds, and homes we didn’t have to work much if at all for because of the enormous American financial system that anyone can access today and on which the entire world now depends.

Are you serious? If you have such wealth and came about it easily I am very happy for you. What little wealth I have was not obtained in such an easy manner.

I’m not saying this financial crisis is going to be the end of the middle class. In fact, I don’t think most people will be significantly impacted. I don’t think there is reason for anyone to panic.

I don’t support the bailout. See my post President Bush determined to use tax dollars to purchase Junk Bonds.

You may want to try to not read so much into what someone writes.

Why the anonymity?

I repeat my suggestion as to what real, godly wisdom is, and what Christians should be saying today: “Let’s dispense with the ‘think what could happen’ talking rooted in fear. Let’s acknowledge that we got into this mess by having government try to play God, and that we don’t get out of such a mess by having government continue to play God. We have the largest, most wealthy, most stable middle class in the history of the world because for the first 170 years of our history we trusted God, required moral accountability of our government, and kept it out of the way of hard work, innovation, private property and wealth creation by the private sector. We thus live in cities we did not build, our houses are richly stocked with goods we did not produce, we draw water from sources we did not dig, and we eat from olive trees and vineyards we did not plant (Deut. 6:10-11). We also have stores of financial wealth in stocks, bonds, and homes we didn’t have to work much if at all for because of the enormous American financial system that anyone can access today and on which the entire world now depends. All of this is the blessing of the American nation beause we have historically worshiped God, not government. Now we have stopped worshiping God and trust in government instead – we ought to change the motto on the dollar to say, ‘In Government We Trust.’ Part of faithfulness to God is taking responsibility for our actions and expecting others to do the same rather than having government play savior and bail us all out. Let’s trust in God, be peaceful, and see clearly the way back to both spiritual and financial health.”

I don’t think one has to be dishonest to worry about that. That’s a bit of a reach.

The idea that “the middle class is just a job loss away from the lower class” is pure fear – it is un-Christian both in the sense of being rooted in fear and of accepting uncritically the world’s wisdom about things.

First of all, you left out a word that changes the meaning of your first clause. Leaving out the word “many” seems to imply that ALL middle class was intended which was not the case. How is it un-Christian? How is it rooted in fear? How have I accepted uncritically the world’s wisdom?

You’ve really thrown some large stones and I’m afraid you’re in a glass house.

My point was that there are people in the middle class for whom this economic downturn will be a crisis. It seemed to me that earlier posts were dismissing the possibility of middle class suffering as if no one in the middle class ever becomes poor. That is simply not the case. No fear involved in that. Just facts. Lose your job and remain unemployed long enough (how much cash do most people have to survive such events) and you will be poor. Worldly wisdom? Give me a break.

My suggestion doesn’t depend on whether the middle class is shrinking or not. I know poor people BEFORE the so called “economic crisis” who work two jobs and have to buy VALUE brand everything at the grocery store and go without electricity sometimes just to make it by, can’t afford a car, and sometimes have to visit Social Ministries just to get food.

Not everybody is educated in economics, but we should all be compassionate with those who are going through tough times, whether it’s because of the economic “crisis” or just because they are poor, or both.

Here’s some more fodder for you, I suppose:
http://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/1985/03/art1full.pdf
It’s also from the 80s.

Perhaps I should rephrase that one:
“Do you have a source that less than a decade old?”

I didn’t say I was in “better” shape than those in the middle class with mortgages, I said I was in a more “stable” financial position than those in the middle class with tons of debt. There is a difference. I don’t live month to month, and I live within my pay range. It is a documented fact that most in the middle class owe thousands of dollars in debt (not including their mortage) and live month to month on their pay checks. If someone is living month to month and loses their job, they are in trouble quickly. To deny that seems ludicrous to me.

As for “staying calm, trusting God” and learning basic economic principles, I don’t think I said anything to the contrary.

As for denying that the middle-class is shrinking, I don’t see how anyone can deny that the gap between the “haves” and the “have nots” is increasing at the present time. In economic downtimes, this is what happens. I’m not suggesting that the economy won’t recover (I think it eventually will).

No pattern whatsoever? Where do you get your information?

The American middle class is not shrinking – this whole idea is one promoted by leftist politicians, academics, and media as an attack on capitalism, which creates and is symbolized and supported most powerfully by the existence of the middle class. Karl Marx hated the middle class – called them the “bourgeoisie” and blamed them for all the ills of society – and sought to lead a revolution of the proletariat against the bourgeoisie and establish a socialist utopia ruled by the poor working classes. Attempts to diminish the middle class and paint capitalism as doing nothing but creating a bigger and bigger gap between rich and poor, and therefore as a fundamentally unjust system in need of government intervention on behalf of the poor and working classes, is just the same line of thought in less aggressive and explicit garb.

If it comforts you to tell yourself living in an apartment and making peanuts puts you in better shape than the middle classes, go right ahead, but the American middle class, which you are likely to enter as soon as you finish seminary even if you become a missionary, is as strong and vibrant as ever. Here is an article from Time magazine in the 1980’s, for example, when the Reagan era had led to renewed economic prosperity and a flourishing of both the middle and upper classes, discussing why lefties insisted even then on arguing the middle class was shrinking when it quite clearly was not.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,962753,00.html

In sum, “crisis” is not too strong a word for what we are in right now, but it is a crisis focused in the highest levels of the financial system, not the poor or middle classes, most of whom have not even been touched, is rooted only in mortgages and real estate investment instruments, was created by government meddling with markets, and will only be made worse by more government meddling with markets. Proper message to and from Christians everywhere: “Trust God, be peaceful, oppose bailouts, know government cannot play God, work hard, be financially responsible, be economically literate, and we will be fine. Don’t trust God, be anxious and fearful, support bailouts and the welfare state, make financial and economic decisions based on that fear and worry, and we will not be fine because we will be trusting in ourselves. The choice is simple.”